ATHE_Transcript_Ep 407_Debra Atkinson
JJ Virgin: [00:00:00] Alright. You have been asking for this. So I'm bringing it to you. I have been getting so many questions about like, what should I do before I work out? Do I need to eat? What should I eat? What about afterwards? And I have a friend who honestly, I cannot believe I have not gotten on the podcast yet [00:01:00] because she is so amazing.
She really is the top expert now in exercise during and after menopause. She is amazing. Her name is Debra Atkinson. She has this great book. First of all, she's going to be giving you this book. You can get it at jjvirgin.com/flippingfifty . And that's her brand F L I P P I N G fifty.com. She's going to give you her book hot, not bothered 99.
Faley flips to slimmer trimmer fitter faster. So you can master metabolism before, during and long after. She also, she has helped over 145,000 women, 50 plus flipped their second half. And really it's like, making 50 the new 30, you're going to hear about how much better shape she's in. And I'm in, in our fifties than we ever were in our thirties, despite being fitness people.
She also wrote you still got it. Girl, the after 50 fitness formula for women navigating fitness after 50. So, this is really [00:02:00] her world for 35 years. He has dug in and she has really done the research is little, like not a whole lot of it, by the way. Women menopause and beyond, and how to get the best results.
So we are going to share all of that with you today. Now, before we go there, I want to do a shout out to Nicole Hallett and she did a five-star review on iTunes. She says, love this podcast, JJ Virgin's lifestyle podcast is seriously. So. She always has amazing guests who are so knowledgeable in their area of expertise.
Every episode is full of great advice and tips. I also love how each episode is short and sweet and straight to the point, keep them coming. Well, thank you. That is one of the things I strive to do, cause I know we are busy. So my big goal with these is to give you actionable information based on what you guys are asking for.
So here's the thing. If there's something you want to know more about. Pop on over to iTunes, leave a review and say, I want to know X, Y, or Z, [00:03:00] whatever it is. And I will go hunt down the best guests, or I will do it myself because some of these are my favorite topics. Before I dive in, I want to share another one of my favorites with[00:04:00]
Debra Atkinson. Welcome to the show. It is about darn time.
Debra Atkinson: I am so glad to hear you on the other end of this.
JJ Virgin: I know. So for everyone listening, I've known Deborah for years and she has got this awesome brand all around, flipping fifty. How the heck to, and this is something that's not addressed because I got to tell you, I think I'm not alone.
Most 50 plus year old women don't want to like get exercise instruction from some 25 year old in booty shorts and a jog bra. Right. Am I right? Can I hear an Amen? [00:05:00] Amen. Amen. And so you just tackled this one, which I'm thrilled about, but the other day something was coming up and I saw a post that you'd written.
you'd written about Eating and exercise because this comes up all the time in my community. People are like, and it's, it's a super confusing situations. Like, do you eat before exercise, after exercise don't eat at all? Should we, should we be fasting? Like what the heck do we do? So I know we're going to tackle this today and I am very excited for us to do this, but before we get there, What got you into all of this?
Cause I actually don't know
Debra Atkinson: a midlife crisis, so that's a whole number show
for me is year 35, literally. This is when I changed my major from graphic design. And I knew, you know, I wasn't quite [00:06:00] fitting in because way back then everybody smoked and drank. If they were in graphic design, they stayed up all night. And I was like, I can't do that. Can't do it. And had some great instructors.
So the, the short story. I was like, I want to make other people feel the way I have felt from these fantastic instructors. And of course it starts being, you know, I want to look good, but it was like how I felt, whatever else I could do. And then I thought I got my older adult clients. I thought I got my older females because I was raised by older parents had older brothers and sisters.
I was doing research before I knew I was doing research. And then I turn 49. I was like, oh
JJ Virgin: wow.
Debra Atkinson: I flipped my world upside down. I quit my job. I wanted to have a bigger reach. And I said, I'm going digital. [00:07:00] We've had some really good luck here in the very conservative, very Midwest and if we can do it, anybody can do it. And I realized I want to help train. Connect better, but in order to do that, I've got to still be talking to that market myself and demonstrating I'm doing it.
I can't get irrelevant and, and just be talking, right. So. As I was doing all this research and then I panicked, I quit my job, no insurance, no safety security. I left the university, all of these really secure things. I'd seen from a dad who worked for 40 years and then got a clock, you know, and nobody does that anymore.
And I realize I've got to pay college tuition in eight months. What did I just do? And so I locked and chained myself to a keyboard and went from exercising for hours a day, typically to I'd let myself maybe a for 20 minutes. [00:08:00] And when you do that, of course you make every minute count. So it became more intense.
I was simultaneously researching it online. What's really happening during perimenopause menopause and beyond. And then I was, I was the study of one. I was literally my demographic, totally stressed, totally panicked and beginning to have things under the hood change and hearing from all kinds of women, nobody gets us.
It's not working. What used to work isn't working anymore.
JJ Virgin: Cardio is definitely not working or
Debra Atkinson: from those women who thought they never had to do anything now, suddenly they, they are aware I've got to do something
JJ Virgin: and think they should go hit the hardest CrossFit.
Debra Atkinson: Exactly. Exactly. So after 14 months of about eight major life changes eight, you know, and I hadn't counted on six of them.
I signed up for a couple, but I was just [00:09:00] like underwater literally, but I was in the best shape of my life. I looked better. Felt better. And it was 20 minutes of exercise that was helping me balance hormones and balance the stress. And I realized I've got something here. I've got to share this. And that's really flipping 50, take it any way you want, but I flipped my life.
And then I worked really hard to talk on every platform about how other women can flip theirs.
JJ Virgin: I just loved the whole story because I look back back when I was cause we've been doing the same amount of time. It's crazy. And back in the legwarmer days. Well,
then I had clients, my clients were 45 to 55 years old. And I think now, and I'm like, sorry guys, gals. I didn't know. You know, and there really wasn't information about this. All like I was in graduate school at the time all the studies were being done [00:10:00] on college age, mainly guys and, you know, Yeah,
Debra Atkinson: 39% of studies still are on, on only females.
Right? So we've got like 60% of research is still on males. Still on young, hit fit males. And so we've really got
JJ Virgin: to look at what the heck. My God. So what do we do? Like. I know you've found some, but I think a lot of what we probably learned in this is by working with that clientele and kind of understanding what happens with hormones.
So, you know, what, what are you seeing with women? Let's not talk food yet. Let's just talk, exercise women heading into menopause in menopause. What are some of the big exercise mistakes that they can make?
Debra Atkinson: We're still, you nailed it earlier. We're still spending way too much time doing cardio [00:11:00] or we're, you know,I'm not even sure.
you'd qualify it as cardiac going for walks, which I'm not going to throw into the bus. That's a good thing. But thinking that you, you do the same speed, the same distance, probably the same route every single day. And. You know, you're not getting results, but you're going to keep doing that. There's
JJ Virgin: something has to change saying here's what I view walking.
As we all need to buy to, everyone should own a dog. I'm looking at mine right now. Who's sitting there pouting, right? Everyone should have a dog and you should walk your dog every day. And that is not exercise.
Debra Atkinson: That's
JJ Virgin: right. That is brushing your teeth. That is flossing your teeth. That is just part of what?
Every day we got to floss, we got to brush, we got to drink water, eat some vegetables, walk and get good, but that's. Exercise. I like to say, you know, in order for it to count as exercise, you have to get hot, sweaty and should hurt a bit. But this doesn't mean go kill yourself on CrossFit either. So we've got people out there [00:12:00] counting, walking, which just should be part of your activities of daily livings.
Why we should track as exercise. What should they be doing?
Debra Atkinson: They should be strength training. And if you ask me that again, I will say they should be strength training.
Because it enables every other thing in your life to be easier
JJ Virgin: for
Debra Atkinson: every other thing. Easier. So yes, you should be doing cardio. We've got to do some kind of getting breathless, you know, as my definition of cardio, everybody should get breathless. And if you love yoga awesome. But you can't just choose yoga and say, that's my exercise. Well, you've got a heart, you've got muscles, you've got bones.
You got to take care of it. All the girlfriend. So strength training is the common denominator that will make you stronger and better and more confident in yoga. Even if you hate yoga. I know I'm talking to somebody who [00:13:00] maybe doesn't know
JJ Virgin: you're not, I don't, I love throwing weights around though. I love that.
But yoga. Yes. I, I. I it's so funny. Cause I was just talking to my husband again. I go, you know, we really got to start, you know, like, this is what we start, we start this whole, like, we really should start yoga and then we grumble about it and grumble about it and then maybe we'll go to a class and we're like, okay, well check that off the years list.
It's like, I want to, like, I want to be the person that likes yoga sadly. Not gonna happen, not
Debra Atkinson: going to happen. And that's okay. Whoever you are when you're listening, but we need range of motion, movement. We need some kind of stretching and, and you've got to keep yourself able to do the other thing. So if you have a priority, I love doing this.
I love playing golf. I love doing this. You've still got to do a little cardio and a little strength training in that mobility to keep you doing
JJ Virgin: that. Yeah. So notice, you said little cardio, not hours of cardio, a little bit of cardio, because [00:14:00] as we know, hours of cardio actually can age you more. So we're not doing that.
All right. So let's dive in, then let's talk. Let's talk food because gosh, this one comes up all the time and I think it's more confusing than ever because of, you know, this whole breakfast, skipping, intermittent fasting gig going on. So someone's going to exercise and of course, some of this is gonna depend on when you exercise, but what's your basic recommendations.
Debra Atkinson: It's really about, and probably the most basic of all is you. And I know that we're all a unique thumbprint. So our gut health are what stresses me versus what stresses you. What's long cardio for me. And what's long for you all that is different. So first of all, everybody listening and take this into.
Here's what I know works for me, but too many of us are like beating that drum and doing more of what doesn't work. Let's stop that right now. [00:15:00] So secondly, look at the intensity of the exercise that you're going to be doing and eat accordingly because your body. It has a preference for what it's going to burn during certain activities.
And that's really important to pay attention to. So the higher, the intensity that you're going to work, and let's define that as really getting breathless. So you and I both like to throw weights around and I would qualify using heavy weight and definitely reaching fatigue, which we may want to define that's intense, but there is something.
About weight training, which temporarily will yes. Raise or elevate your heart rate while you're doing a lift, but you recover between that's different than doing high intensity interval, training your body and doing those 30 seconds to breathless hands on my knees, I gotta bend over and I deserve this break that kind of work out your body needs a little bit more [00:16:00] carbohydrate to get you going it's preference.
Is that because essentially it's. Right. It can't multitask very well. So if you're working super hard, your body is not going to be able to go and get fat, because that is much harder for your body to derive and turn it into energy while you're breathing super hard. So a little bit of carbohydrate is actually helpful.
And let's come back to. Okay. What about intermittent fasting? I thought if I didn't eat anything that I would then burn more fat.
JJ Virgin: I'm so excited to have someone else saying, okay. Cause I know what everyone's thinking right now. They're going, but wait a minute. I don't want to burn sugar and carbs during exercise. I want to burn.
Debra Atkinson: Yeah, well, and we're going to be still careful about the kind of
JJ Virgin: food.
Debra Atkinson: No, and you're not having a goo. I mean, [00:17:00] let's just kill
that, right now.
JJ Virgin: Is that you're not doing five hours of marathon running, even if you were goo, would not be the best option. Right. You're not, you're doing a short exercise. And by the way, it's really not about the fat you're burning during, during exercise. Is it.
Debra Atkinson: Nope. It's about the fat you're burning after. So literally if you're doing high intensity interval training, the proportion, the percentage of that you're burning during those moments is very small, but the overall caloric burn, the energy burn is so high that a small percentage of a big number is still pretty good.
And then it's the two for one. So afterward for hours afterwards, you're burning more fat. That's the real benefit. Let's do that again all day long, right? But not
JJ Virgin: really, but that's what we really want to do the, the time when your body can really access, stored fat for fuel is when you're sitting, when you're at lower intensity.
I remember way back when this [00:18:00] craziness, where we had to monitor our target heart rate and our training zone. And if we weren't working out for at least 30 minutes, we shouldn't even bother because we didn't get into our fat burning zone. We had to be in our, and it was like, well, this is just silly when you look at it, if exercise, if what we're trying to do is a.
Improve our muscle mass so that we have better metabolic rate and better insulin sensitivity and B, burn a bunch of sugar and make it so our body has to recover harder and is better at burning fat all day long. It's really a. Having more energy walking into that session. And I think that's why you said, if you have some carbs prior to working out, now, you're going to have more energy during that session.
You'll be able to train harder, right?
Debra Atkinson: Exactly. You train harder, you can train longer. If, of course that's appropriate without feeling like it's harder or longer so that we don't want to skip. Right. Cause nobody wants to repeat a workout. That feels like hell, right. I mean, you got to like it a little bit and I know you [00:19:00] say there's got to be a little bit of pain.
Well, yes, I think that's true, but, but you really got to know. Okay. There's a little bit of, I'm going to get really uncomfortable. But I got a break coming.
JJ Virgin: I'm not talking joint pain. People I'm talking. Yes. Little bit of pain. Now. What about what you shouldn't like the big mistakes? What you shouldn't eat before or after you work?
Debra Atkinson: A lot of fiber. So normally, right, we want to get fiber in those smoothies. We want to get a lot of protein, get a lot of fat, but some of us are unique in this and that, you know, we can eat almost anything and then we can go, we feel pretty good, but a lot of women I find in midlife are not that person either anymore or never were.
So they don't want to feel like they're bogged down, you know, and if you eat a lot of fiber right before you exercise, that's the opposite of how you want to feel. You want things that will clear your gut. So you feel light [00:20:00] and you feel like I've got energy. I'm ready to go. And, you know, you're not held back.
So you don't want to put fiber in. You may want a very simple smoothie before. Cause it's fairly easy to digest. It's already broken down. It's not going to weigh you down, but don't put your fiber in that one. Hold the fiber until afterward. That's one. If you have too much fat for you, now I can. I can eat like a quarter to a half of an avocado before a work out.
If I'm hungry and take the edge off my hunger and feel really pretty good, but not everybody could do that because it is high fat and it would take a little longer to digest. So, you know, look at. What are you doing now? How's your energy level during your session and then test, right? Don't guess someone I know and respect says that a lot, right?
JJ Virgin: Yeah. And that's, I think these things are counterintuitive, but you really don't want, like, in life, we [00:21:00] want you to have fiber and healthy fats and it slows down stomach emptying. You feel fuller longer, and it's awesome. But not when you're going to go work. Exactly. You do not. You know, your body focusing on digestion rather than on getting blood flow to the working muscles.
We only have so much blood flow. It's not like we can go, Hey, let's have some extra. Nope. That's not happening now. You also did something kind of cool. And you used your DNA results and you use them to help you do better. So let's like, let's talk a little bit about that. That's exciting. I did that. I did my DNA too, so I think it's really cool stuff to have.
Debra Atkinson: Yeah. Well, the most exciting thing I found from my DNA is, I metabolize caffeine really well. So I
JJ Virgin: exactly
Debra Atkinson: what I found out was. You know, I desperately wanted to be somebody who could shift their ability to burn fat at higher and higher [00:22:00] levels of intensity. And I was really trying to reduce the amount of carbs that I was having before exercise so that I could become a fat burner and better at it.
And that takes time. Some people can do that better than others, but I am not. One of them is what I found out for my DNA and I wasn't experiencing great results, but I was falling into that trap a little bit of, let's do more of what's not working. Okay.
JJ Virgin: So much information right now. That's making people once again. Phobic and, you know, it's, and there's still that info out there where people seem to think that in order to burn fat, they've got to be in ketosis and like you know, especially if you've got adrenal problems, if you've got thyroid issues, if you're going through menopause, this is not the place to be.
And that's not the case. And that's, that's what makes me concerned. I mean, there's times when this is a great diet and there's people. It's great. Times and people it's not it's, there's never something that's going to work for [00:23:00] all people all the time.
Debra Atkinson: Great point. Great. And so what I've found is that I really do better with a little higher level of carbohydrate.
So specifically focusing on increasing carbohydrates that I have before I exercise. And then post exercise. And here's another thing that I did. I actually tested the status of my muscles and they can do that on any muscle tissue, but typically they'll do something like your quads or
JJ Virgin: your hamstrings, like a muscle biopsy.
Exactly
Debra Atkinson: ultrasound. Yeah. So nobody was stuffing that thing. Right. And, you know, big ego hit. Cause here I w you know, I'm doing great. You know, I can't wait to get this back. I mean, he's going to see like some really good, no, I was like dehydrated. My muscle was not doing very well. He's like, you probably need to take a look this.
[00:24:00] So I was like, okay, nutritionally, we're going to change the game. Yeah. So now I recover so much quicker. You know, I didn't know what, I didn't know. You settle without knowing you're settling. If you don't know how good you can feel on the other side. So as I kind of sandwich my workout with a little bit more carbohydrate, pre a little bit more right after, as well as protein to hang on to that lean muscle tissue, for sure.
I'm doing so much better. I rebound quicker. I feel better. I'm giving more during my workouts. Go figure. All of that is you've got to look at what are you doing? What could be better? Change it, test it for a week, two weeks, see how you feel.
JJ Virgin: Yeah. And that is so key and critical. Cause I think, you know, it reminds me of the old weight Watchers thing where I thought where you're counting points and I went, yeah, but what if you're not hungry?
It says you need to eat now and I go, but what if you're not hungry? What if you don't want to eat that much? What if you know where we [00:25:00] disconnect from. Like our own innate intelligence. Like, you know, if you feel better when you have some carbs and then go work out, if you do, and you can get a better workout and guess what?
It's just like this whole breakfast skipping thing, you skip breakfast. Women tend to have elevated blood pressure, elevated cortisol, you know, and they, even though they might eat a little less throughout the day because of it, they actually. Have a slower metabolism too. So it's a rebound bad effect for most women.
It's not thing to do. So we've got to really look at how things work for us, and now I'm going to stop my rant. All right. Now I know you have a lot of this information and I, first of all, I love this, this book so much the the hot not bothered. And is that the book that you're giving away for everybody free?
Absolutely.
Debra Atkinson: And they can get it immediately.
JJ Virgin: Yeah. So everyone can get this at [00:26:00] jjvirgin.com/flippingfifty and that is F L I P P I N G F I F T Y. We will have all the great show notes in there. Also put my favorite smoothie in there for after a workout. And again, it's different than the typical smoothie, cause it's not loaded down with fiber and.
And it's when you can do pre and post, and again, the name of the book is hot, not bothered, right?
Debra Atkinson: Exactly. Yes. Hot.
JJ Virgin: Tell us all about hot, not bothered, you know, it's,
Debra Atkinson: Pick it up, read a tip for today, put it down. So for those of you who are, you know, short on time, but I want to pick up little tips and retain them.
This is your book about a third of each of the. Little tips that are in there or about nutrition. A third are about exercise and third are about the lifestyle habits, but every single one of these 99 flips is research. That's only been done on women in perimenopause menopause, or post-menopause.
JJ Virgin: You really [00:27:00] are the leading expert on this.
You have like just taken it on and owned it. I like so, so thrilled to have you as a resource. So again, everyone, you can get this at jjvirgin.com/flippingfifty, and you'll get the hot, not bothered book 99 flips. I love those. I love the whole flipping fifty brand, you know, I think. Flipping cute. So it's so fast.
And you know, I mean, because I'm 55 and I know that 50 is definitely the new 30, I feel better now than ever. And that's really the biggest thing to get out that message to get out. Cause you said the exact same thing, you can feel better. Look better, be better than you were in your twenties and thirties and forties.
When you put this information to place, if exercise was a drug, it would be the number one prescribed drug. Hands down, right. I mean, especially for brain, for bone, for everything. So, but you got to do it, right? So here's all the tools that you need to do it right. To do the right eating choices with it and to have [00:28:00] amazing results.
Debra, thank you so much for hanging out with me today. I so appreciate you.
Debra Atkinson: Love my time with you. Thank you.
JJ Virgin: All right. Now, after the break, I'll be answering a listener's question. So stay with me.
Welcome back. This is the time where I answer listener's question. Hey, if you are not hanging out with me on Facebook at JJVirginOfficial or instagram at jj.virgin, I jump in there and do lives and answer questions every week. Sometimes a couple times a week. Depends on what's going on and how much I'm traveling.
So I would love to hang out with you and that's where I get a lot of these questions. But today's question actually does not come from there. It comes from my girlfriend, Chalene Johnson. She sent me a voicemail the other day and she said, JJ, I want to feature you on my podcast and what you do for your workout.
So to walk me through a weekly workout routine and all right, now, here's the deal. I travel about 50% of the time, sometimes more. Now that I'm [00:29:00] settling into Tampa life, I'm traveling less because like, who wants to leave? Hello. But I still, no matter where I am, I basically have a routine and that is what super key and important, because I think a lot of people will use traveling as an excuse, not to work out.
And I actually use an excuse to try some fun, different stuff, meaning that I'm going to get to a different gym. They'll have different equipment. I can do different things, but I'm always going to do three things here. They are. Well, actually four. These are my core four fitness formula. And and I'll, I'll put that in the notes too.
I have my fast fitness program. So again, JJvirgin.com/flippingfifty. Don't forget about that. You're going to get that cool. E-book from Debra right away, digital download. And then I'll put some links for some other stuff. Like my good smoothie recipe for post-workout, et cetera. For working out.
Number one, we talked about it. Moving more. I'm looking at my dog as we speak you going to want to make sure that you're moving every day, but do not think this is exercise, this is like flossing. [00:30:00] Okay. We need to do this. And if you're not flossing, then we've got a whole nother discussion too. But flossing walking, water, good sleep vegetables.
Kind of key And of course taking your daily multivitamin, mineral antioxidant and fish oil formula too.. I'll put that in the notes. I'm looking at mine on the table sitting right here. Ready for me to take, so that's step 1 is moving more. And this is where tracking with an aura ring or a Fitbit really, really helps.
I have my aura ring on. I track my sleep every night. I'm about to put my Fitbit back on too. I kind of like to dual track Maybe that's a little obsessive, but they give me different information. So that's the first thing is moving more. Second is high intensity interval training, and that is that cardio burst training.
You can do that by running upstairs. You can do that. Using an exciser, we'll put the info for the exciser and how to do that in the show notes as well. You can do. Through like walking and sprinting, you can do that on a StairMaster. So whatever you need to do to go all out for 30 to 60 [00:31:00] seconds, recover for twice as long and repeat to accumulate four to eight total minutes of all out bursting, but again, in 30 to 62nd increments, and this is where you get breathless.
It hurts a little, it's not easy. And as you get stronger, guess what? You just make it harder. Third one. And you heard us talking about that is throwing weights around. Now you can do some high intensity interval training and throw weights around and mix it up, back and forth. That's another great thing to do, but I've divided the body and this is my fast fitness program into pushing upper body pushing, which are things like chest and shoulders and triceps, upper body pulling lats, biceps, and shoulders, and then power core back and abs and.
Hips and thighs and what I do, hips, thighs and legs. What I do is I divide into those four and I hit each body part at least twice a week. And that's key critical for keeping your bones strong for keeping your metabolism up for staying insulin sensitive, super important. I just did like the most ridiculous fall.
I'm embarrassed to [00:32:00] say down a flight of stairs, texting. Yes, I did. One of my friends texted me something about getting married and it was like one of my long-term bachelor friends, and I literally fell down the stairs when I read it. I haven't told him yet. And it was. Missed a step and fell down another step and onto marble, which should have just like, I mean, I was like lying there in a puddle going, what on earth did I break?
Answer was nothing. Why? Lots of good strong bones and muscles because of resistance training. So super important then of course the fourth is adding in some flexibility. I almost forgot it as you heard, because it's not my favorite part. But I incorporate in, as I'm doing resistance training and one day.
When I do get to yoga, I'll be telling everyone about it. And hopefully it'll be one day soon. If you see me, hold me to it. All right. That is it again? Make sure you grab the show notes, JJvirgin.com/flippingfifty all spelled out. And I will see you next time. And thanks again for the review.
I'd love to give you a shout out. So if you haven't left a review yet, go on over there. And while you're there, [00:33:00] subscribe and share it with the path.